Concealed Carry: for the non believers.

[JudgeDredd]

To those who question the

a.) right

b.) privilege

of those who decide to carry a firearm off duty as an officer or as a regular citizen, this link is for you.



http://www.nbc4i.com/news/10110898/detail.html



Even in the nicest places, the strangest things can happen.

[ProudPops]

I agree, was actually hoping to some punk get his shit handed to him, oh well. The problem is that most business' have their place posted for no firearms. So if you do have the permit and carry where you're not supposed to, you're breaking the law. If you don't have a permit and carry, you're breaking the law. So you might as well just carry.
Pops

[owndjoo]

if i remember rite, the signs mean nothing..... john'll have to update us on that. I think that it's limited to gov't. property,banks,schools, bars,cars,etc. but other than that you can carry whether they post a sign or not.

[Pedro]

if i remember rite, the signs mean nothing..... john'll have to update us on that. I think that it's limited to gov't. property,banks,schools, bars,cars,etc. but other than that you can carry whether they post a sign or not.

I took the concealed carry class about a year or so ago. I thought I remember reading in the book that you cannot carry in any business or place that has a sign that says it is not permitted. You also cannot legally conceal carry into a business that dispenses alcohol.

[ProudPops]

Pedro's right. There is an Ohio statute that allows any place of business to post, there is official signage with the statute number on it, trust me, I see it every day.
Time for a Pops soapbox story.
A little over four years ago I was lead to believe that I was a hunted man. Yes, it was over a woman and things went south in my life real fast. I have a friend that was a POW in Viet Nam for doing his job as a sniper, his story is told to very few and I am one of the fortunates. The one thing that he told me was, "No matter how tough you think you are, when you take another man's last dying breath, whether he is your enemy or not, you have to live with that for the rest of your life. Make sure that is the last option you have!" I ran that through my head a thousand times over the weeks of mental torment. I had gotten to the point of picturing my wounded or dead dogs. I knew where I was going to kill this person in my house, and I knew what the brain stain was going to look like on the wall behind him as he came up my stairs. I had now mentally prepared myself to take another man's life and I was a wreck, carrying everywhere I went and looking over my shoulder. At 11:30 one night I hear the gravel crunching in my driveway, dogs go ballistic, I grab my .45 off the nightstand. The dogs are in full attack mode, I'm locked and loaded. This is it, the pounding comes on the door, dogs charge. I'm yelling at the top of my lungs, "Go away! I've got a gun, I will shoot you!" Dogs head down the stairs and I follow, so much for my plan. I turn the corner, gun aimed head high to the back door. I am now pointing a loaded gun at someone who I loved very much, thinking it was someone different. She wanted her remote because her new boyfriend was in town. She could have died that night, and almost did. A few days later I settled down, made some calls and handled my problem another way. Situation settled.
My point is, don't carry because it's cool. Protect what you have, but if it's replaceable, let them have it. I don't know what it's like to take a man's last dying breath. I do know what it's like to prepare yourself to do that, and that was a mental train wreck for me.
Pops

[MaverickK6]

Drag that why we never go anywhere without it.... But yes the post is correct if there is a sign you can't bring it in. It's a first degree mis... But then would like tried by 6 or carried by 12............

[Kawboy]

Dag, Dog! I don't know how big you are, but I hope it doesn't take twelve to carry my casket. I wish my last jury only had six, I'd be allowed to go places then.
KB

[owndjoo]

yea, he def. had that backwards.

[walther_gsp]

Fight Crime, shoot back.

http://media.putfile.com/How-To-Make-Swiss-Cheese80

This happened in Columbus. I spoke with the guy about the shooting and told his story to the last CCW class that I taught.

[ProudPops]

Now that's what I'm talkin' 'bout!
Doing the Glock Rock!
Pops
:devilzwhite:
Oh yeah, Djoo, that was some cool shit in the WERA website!

[JudgeDredd]

[quote="walther_gsp":5a270]
Fight Crime, shoot back.

http://media.putfile.com/How-To-Make-Swiss-Cheese80

This happened in Columbus. I spoke with the guy about the shooting and told his story to the last CCW class that I taught.
[/quote:5a270]

THATS THE VIDEO!!! I was looking for that!!!

[owndjoo]

Now that's what I'm talkin' 'bout!
Doing the Glock Rock!
Pops
:devilzwhite:
Oh yeah, Djoo, that was some cool shit in the WERA website!


what'd i do now? :eek: hehe, i'm always raisin hell over there. my dad calls me all the time and tells me to just shut up, i have a lot of fun with it... what thread are you talkin about?

[walther_gsp]

[quote="walther_gsp":c7b08]Fight Crime, shoot back.

http://media.putfile.com/How-To-Make-Swiss-Cheese80

This happened in Columbus. I spoke with the guy about the shooting and told his story to the last CCW class that I taught.


THATS THE VIDEO!!! I was looking for that!!![/quote:c7b08]


I had it filed away in my email, under "Proper use of a fat chick for cover & concealment."

[ProudPops]

The Nuke shot.
Don't ever worry about runnin your mouth, mine's nonstop.
Pops

[MaverickK6]

I did have that backwards//////

[JRMMiii]

/thread resurrected.
I thought Gun + non-believers fit well with Guns + Churches

Proposed Law Would Allow Guns in Churches
http://www.katv.com/news/stories/0109/590527.html

Copied text for the ones who have the site blocked or can't get the link:
Little Rock, AR - Should you be able to carry a gun to church? It's a question state lawmakers will be taking up next week when they debate a bill that's kicked up a little controversy. The bill being discussed would let churches decide on their own to post a sign to ban guns inside, but opponents say it should not even be an option.

Grant Exton is a gun owner and president of the state's Concealed Carry Association. He's been working with lawmakers on a bill that would allow people licensed to carry a concealed handgun to take their guns to church. Exton says the proposed law's less about guns and more about property rights.

(Grant Exton, Concealed Carry Association) "Businesses, homes here in Arkansas are able to make the decision on whether they want to have people carrying on their premise, and we're just trying to give that right to churches as well."

It's also about personal protection. Exton cites the 2007 shooting that killed one person and injured four others in a Colorado church, where a gun-carrying church security worker stopped the shooter.

(Exton) "She was able to stop them at the door, while 7,000 congregants were seated in the pews and the Colorado Springs police said she probably saved a couple hundred lives."

Little Rock pastor John Phillips, now at Central Church of Christ, has first-hand experience with guns in the sanctuary. In 1986, while working at a different church, across town, he was gunned down in the pulpit.

(John Phillips, Little Rock Pastor) "A gentleman came into the church. He was mentally deranged, and at the end of the sermon, pulled out a gun and shouted something about baptism and proceeded to shoot me in the back a couple of times. I still carry one of the bullets embedded in my spine."

Phillips says philosophically, a sanctuary is a place of peace and should be gun free. As for protection, despite what he's been through, he says he feels safer in a church with no guns.

(Phillips) "We really believe God provides and protects his own and that it wouldn't be in the best interest of what the church stands for to have people armed and packing on Sunday morning."

This weekend marks 23 years since Reverend Phillips was shot. The bill goes before a house committee on Tuesday.
Discuss.

I also wonder how everyone would feel if this story was done about a mosque or synagogue. Let the Jews and Muslims CC in their respective places of worship... acceptable or not?

[fusion]

Meh not even a question. It's private property, it's their choice whether or not they allow guns, strippers, mopeds... or not

[flounder]

Linky no worky

[MadMax33]

I truly despise "Gun-Free" zones and I would have to have something on me regardless of the law, which pretty much pisses on your right to self-defense. Hey, Virginia Tech could have been prevented if someone decided to break the law and carry a firearm, thus putting that loser away before he took anyone else with him. I'll take a misdemeanor over a casket anyday.

[InyaAzz]

Pedro's right. There is an Ohio statute that allows any place of business to post, there is official signage with the statute number on it, trust me, I see it every day.
Time for a Pops soapbox story.
A little over four years ago I was lead to believe that I was a hunted man. Yes, it was over a woman and things went south in my life real fast. I have a friend that was a POW in Viet Nam for doing his job as a sniper, his story is told to very few and I am one of the fortunates. The one thing that he told me was, "No matter how tough you think you are, when you take another man's last dying breath, whether he is your enemy or not, you have to live with that for the rest of your life. Make sure that is the last option you have!" I ran that through my head a thousand times over the weeks of mental torment. I had gotten to the point of picturing my wounded or dead dogs. I knew where I was going to kill this person in my house, and I knew what the brain stain was going to look like on the wall behind him as he came up my stairs. I had now mentally prepared myself to take another man's life and I was a wreck, carrying everywhere I went and looking over my shoulder. At 11:30 one night I hear the gravel crunching in my driveway, dogs go ballistic, I grab my .45 off the nightstand. The dogs are in full attack mode, I'm locked and loaded. This is it, the pounding comes on the door, dogs charge. I'm yelling at the top of my lungs, "Go away! I've got a gun, I will shoot you!" Dogs head down the stairs and I follow, so much for my plan. I turn the corner, gun aimed head high to the back door. I am now pointing a loaded gun at someone who I loved very much, thinking it was someone different. She wanted her remote because her new boyfriend was in town. She could have died that night, and almost did. A few days later I settled down, made some calls and handled my problem another way. Situation settled.
My point is, don't carry because it's cool. Protect what you have, but if it's replaceable, let them have it. I don't know what it's like to take a man's last dying breath. I do know what it's like to prepare yourself to do that, and that was a mental train wreck for me.
Pops

Quoted for truth.

[sporty93]

I agree Max. For me my ccw is like an american express card.......never leave home without it. I am not a paranoid person, just prepared. Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it!

[fusion]

No, really, that makes you pretty much paranoid. :P

[kawi kid]

im taking my class this weekend with my gf, my mom, dad, sister and my sisters fiancee. :lol: its like a family fun day at the shooting range hahaha

[littlecarbsbigsmiles]

For me.....CCW? Uh, my fave rig won't fit in my pocket. Page 134 in my most recent catalog.

http://www.dillonaero.com/uimages/m134d_gun_systems/m134d_steel.jpg (http://www.dillonaero.com/content/p/9/catid/1/pid/1/?viewImg=1&pimg=m134d_gun_systems/m134d_steel.jpg)

coincidentally matches the item number M134-D

[D-Ramey]

having a ccw licence's is a big problem if u ask me...u get treated like a convicted when u get pulled over, you always have to read up on new laws all the time...shit is dumb i got arrested and takin to jail when a cop seen me in my garage working on my bike and seen my gun wuz on my side the cop apporcted the garage and asked me if i seen some guy's on a 4 wheeler i said no i didnt he grabs my hand and puts it behind my back and goes do u have any weapons on u i stated yes i have my gun and i have a ccw licences he said what are u suppost to say when u see a officer and u have ur ccw licences...and i said inform then u are carring a gun but i never know if im in my garage minding my biz and u walk up on me asking me a question about some guys on a atv....i spent 2 days in jail....for this act so everyone beware...lol i got it droped in court but i cant get the 2 days of my life back....lol

[kawi kid]

having a ccw licence's is a big problem if u ask me...u get treated like a convicted when u get pulled over, you always have to read up on new laws all the time...shit is dumb i got arrested and takin to jail when a cop seen me in my garage working on my bike and seen my gun wuz on my side the cop apporcted the garage and asked me if i seen some guy's on a 4 wheeler i said no i didnt he grabs my hand and puts it behind my back and goes do u have any weapons on u i stated yes i have my gun and i have a ccw licences he said what are u suppost to say when u see a officer and u have ur ccw licences...and i said inform then u are carring a gun but i never know if im in my garage minding my biz and u walk up on me asking me a question about some guys on a atv....i spent 2 days in jail....for this act so everyone beware...lol i got it droped in court but i cant get the 2 days of my life back....lol

sounds like you got a cop on a bad day. honestly that is retarted!!!

[Dweezel]

going sat to get mine :)

[kawi kid]

going sat to get mine :)
:badgerrock:

[flounder]

having a ccw licence's is a big problem if u ask me...u get treated like a convicted when u get pulled over, you always have to read up on new laws all the time...shit is dumb i got arrested and takin to jail when a cop seen me in my garage working on my bike and seen my gun wuz on my side the cop apporcted the garage and asked me if i seen some guy's on a 4 wheeler i said no i didnt he grabs my hand and puts it behind my back and goes do u have any weapons on u i stated yes i have my gun and i have a ccw licences he said what are u suppost to say when u see a officer and u have ur ccw licences...and i said inform then u are carring a gun but i never know if im in my garage minding my biz and u walk up on me asking me a question about some guys on a atv....i spent 2 days in jail....for this act so everyone beware...lol i got it droped in court but i cant get the 2 days of my life back....lol

I have a feeling that there is more to your story then that. Ive been pulled over a bunch with my firearm and have never had any problems or any officers that were even bothered by it.

[John]

But then would like tried by 6 or carried by 12............

you have that backwards. there are 12 on a jury.

[John]

I have a feeling that there is more to your story then that. Ive been pulled over a bunch with my firearm and have never had any problems or any officers that were even bothered by it.

yeah i think the majority of officers, once they see you have the license, they realize that you probably are not much of a threat to them... they know you are a law abiding citizen as you went the legal route and got the license, as opposed to a criminal who will carry a gun legal or not.

[R1Limited]

lol you have that backwards. there are 12 on a jury.

[JRMMiii]

You realize you just quoted a post from October 2006, right? I don't think any of the members prior to my post are still active on the board (at least not with those names) at this time.

[Isaac's Papa]

It took me half way through this thread to realize it was 3 years old. I didn't know who the hell any of those people were.

I've notified a few officers when I am required to and I have yet to have one of them give me shit about carrying. Most don't even bat an eye. Actually, the typical response is, "Good."

[D-Ramey]

I have a feeling that there is more to your story then that. Ive been pulled over a bunch with my firearm and have never had any problems or any officers that were even bothered by it.


it happen in a garage not on the street or in my car...but im also 22 year's old how old are u? and about every cop iv ever asked about if they be leave in ccw licences they all say the samething NO.....lol there mad someone can carry a gun that goes to a 12 hour class...and they go to school for 6 months to carrry theres...idk some cops are different...

[kawi kid]

i was talking with our sheriff and he said that they approach someone like they have a gun everytime so it makes nothing to them.

[Isaac's Papa]

it happen in a garage not on the street or in my car...but im also 22 year's old how old are u? and about every cop iv ever asked about if they be leave in ccw licences they all say the samething NO.....lol there mad someone can carry a gun that goes to a 12 hour class...and they go to school for 6 months to carrry theres...idk some cops are different...


You don't have to take a class to carry a gun. You have to take a class to conceal a gun. And I've never had an officer tell me that CCW is a bad idea.

[kawi kid]

And I've never had an officer tell me that CCW is a bad idea.


ditto!!

[D-Ramey]

You don't have to take a class to carry a gun. You have to take a class to conceal a gun. And I've never had an officer tell me that CCW is a bad idea.
where do u live? come to columbus or westerville...lol

[Isaac's Papa]

where do u live? come to columbus or westerville...lol


Yes, unfortunately the Columbus Chief isn't a proponent of conceal carry. I wouldn't call him 'anti' but he definitely doesn't do his part to promote it. I'm glad I live in the sticks.

[John]

You don't have to take a class to carry a gun. You have to take a class to conceal a gun.

to LEGALLY conceal a gun ;)

[kawi kid]

if you illegally conceal a gun you arent making yourself any better than the people that cant pass the background check

[Isaac's Papa]

to LEGALLY conceal a gun ;)


Word.

if you illegally conceal a gun you arent making yourself any better than the people that cant pass the background check

Unless you are of the mindset that one shouldn't be required to have a background check. I am not going to say much more other than "Shall Not Be Infringed!!!"

[kawi kid]

Unless you are of the mindset that one shouldn't be required to have a background check. I am not going to say much more other than "Shall Not Be Infringed!!!"


understood. i see where you are coming from.

[Isaac's Papa]

understood. i see where you are coming from.


Requiring a background check only keeps nobody from carrying a gun. It only takes money out of the pockets of law abiding citizens. If someone cannot pass a background check they are probably going to carry anyway. So, if only criminals can't pass and that doesn't keep them from carrying why make anybody go through it?

[kawi kid]

cuz it gives all the other that false sense of security. and thats what the sheep like.

[John]

vermont style law FTW :)

[Isaac's Papa]

vermont style law FTW :)


You mean Constitution style!!

[John]

exactly.

[Gump]

so without a ccw can't we just walk around with our guns out?

[Gump]

Fight Crime, shoot back.

http://media.putfile.com/How-To-Make-Swiss-Cheese80

This happened in Columbus. I spoke with the guy about the shooting and told his story to the last CCW class that I taught.

Are you teaching a class on March 14th?

[vroddave]

who all is taking there ccw class this saturday. when and where. Me and my fiance is taking it saturday in springfield @ Safetyfirstccw.

[speedfrk39]

my 2 boys my wife and I all have our own personal guns, I would NEVER REGISTER ONE OR GET A PERMIT, if they know you got them they can come and get them. If we need guns to protect life and property, { thats why we have guns} NOBODY is going to give a RATS ASS about some permit.

[vroddave]

you do not have to have a registered gun to get a permit. you don't have to register your gun once you get your permit. it just makes you leagal to conceal a weapon.

[D-Ramey]

Yes, unfortunately the Columbus Chief isn't a proponent of conceal carry. I wouldn't call him 'anti' but he definitely doesn't do his part to promote it. I'm glad I live in the sticks.
your right im not going to argue with u on that...but there are some jackass around here that dont know how to carry right and are just plain stupid and it fucks it up for people like me and u that has commin sence...but ur lucky i wish i lived in the sticks..lol

[Isaac's Papa]

my 2 boys my wife and I all have our own personal guns, I would NEVER REGISTER ONE OR GET A PERMIT, if they know you got them they can come and get them. If we need guns to protect life and property, { thats why we have guns} NOBODY is going to give a RATS ASS about some permit.


We don't have registration in Ohio. Your permit has nothing to do with your gun. You don't even have to own a gun to get a permit. And a prosecutor will give a rat's ass if you are concealing without a permit.

[Blitzburgh]

so without a ccw can't we just walk around with our guns out?

YES in Ohio you can carry a gun as long as it is in plain view.. but, you can NOT be in a vehicle with it loaded in plain view.. You have to follow the laws of transporting a weapon in a vehicle. Also note a motorcycle is considered a vehicle.

[SAMBUSA]

YES in Ohio you can carry a gun as long as it is in plain view.. but, you can NOT be in a vehicle with it loaded in plain view.. You have to follow the laws of transporting a weapon in a vehicle. Also note a motorcycle is considered a vehicle.

with a CCW you can ride concealed:badgerrock:

[Isaac's Papa]

YES in Ohio you can carry a gun as long as it is in plain view.. but, you can NOT be in a vehicle with it loaded in plain view.. You have to follow the laws of transporting a weapon in a vehicle. Also note a motorcycle is considered a vehicle.


Plain view, in a holster. Also, in a vehicle a loaded magazine = a loaded gun. As soon as you enter that vehicle you've officially concealed a weapon. That's a no-no without a permit.

[Isaac's Papa]

with a CCW you can ride concealed:badgerrock:


Or in a thigh rig!! :badgerrock:

[Blitzburgh]

Plain view, in a holster. Also, in a vehicle a loaded magazine = a loaded gun. As soon as you enter that vehicle you've officially concealed a weapon. That's a no-no without a permit.



Which is kind of wacky for a motorcyle.. How do you "enter" a motorcyle.

What if you are leaning on the the motorcyle seat?
What if the keys are not in the bike?
What if the bike is not really moving?
What if I am on the bike but the gun is strapped to my thigh in plain view and the bike is not moving or running?



Personally, I think carrying a weapon in Ohio without a CCW (and wanting to be legal) is pretty crazy when a motorcycle is involved. The open carry/CCW laws are pretty vague when it comes to a motorcycle besides the fact they consider it a vehicle. You are just asking for unneeded trouble.

I use to have a crazy inventory of guns when I worked for Acusport(who supplies dealers) in Bellefontaine. I could get guns at BELOW dealer costs and I had a $2500 credit that they would take out in weekly payments. Hell I made a fortune on Black Talen ammo after they were outlawed.. Anyways, I sold all my stuff over the years. I am planning on buying a CCW weapon this year and taking the test before it is outlawed. Still undecided what I want but Im leaning towards a Glock 30 or 21. Had a chance to buy a Glock 37 cheap from a friend but didn't want to mess with the 45 GAP ammo..

[gixxie750]

i have my ccw,but my dam ruger is way to big to hide!!! Even with a winter coat it looks like i have a gun lol. I really need a smaller gun.

[John]

Also, in a vehicle a loaded magazine = a loaded gun.

stupid law

[SicilianDude357]

I'm 18 but a friend of mine in Cleveland State is a cop and he carries where ever we go... When I told him that the day after I turn 21 I'm buying a handgun for carrying he said "Good"

I'll prob get two guns that day... Springfield 1911 TRP Stainless and a Springfield .40 XDM Black for my carry.... Better start saving cause all that plus ammo and a couple extra magazines is going to cost me about 2Grand....230gr JHP =]

[SAMBUSA]

you can conceal in a car/on motorcycle with ccw. they also just recently gave us the castle law. LMK, when you wanna take the class and i can get you a # for the instructor in our area:badgerrock:

Which is kind of wacky for a motorcyle.. How do you "enter" a motorcyle.

What if you are leaning on the the motorcyle seat?
What if the keys are not in the bike?
What if the bike is not really moving?
What if I am on the bike but the gun is strapped to my thigh in plain view and the bike is not moving or running?



Personally, I think carrying a weapon in Ohio without a CCW (and wanting to be legal) is pretty crazy when a motorcycle is involved. The open carry/CCW laws are pretty vague when it comes to a motorcycle besides the fact they consider it a vehicle. You are just asking for unneeded trouble.

I use to have a crazy inventory of guns when I worked for Acusport(who supplies dealers) in Bellefontaine. I could get guns at BELOW dealer costs and I had a $2500 credit that they would take out in weekly payments. Hell I made a fortune on Black Talen ammo after they were outlawed.. Anyways, I sold all my stuff over the years. I am planning on buying a CCW weapon this year and taking the test before it is outlawed. Still undecided what I want but Im leaning towards a Glock 30 or 21. Had a chance to buy a Glock 37 cheap from a friend but didn't want to mess with the 45 GAP ammo..

[Catman]

I took a butt load of tactical classes about 10 years ago,Still got the deploma's. With TTC out in Adams county. would any of those classes suffice or are they out of date, because they were too long ago ?

[Isaac's Papa]

I took a butt load of tactical classes about 10 years ago,Still got the deploma's. With TTC out in Adams county. would any of those classes suffice or are they out of date, because they were too long ago ?


You are required to take the CCW course. I believe they are working on changing that for enlisted and reservist personnel but I'm not sure where they are on the matter.

[SAMBUSA]

You are required to take the CCW course. I believe they are working on changing that for enlisted and reservist personnel but I'm not sure where they are on the matter.


Don't have to take the course if you are active duty with firearms qualifications. just go to sherriff dept and they will take care of it

[v65rider]

Are there any instructors on here, and if so are you going to have a class anytime soon?

[Gump]

If i wanted to go shoot some skeet and take my bike..put the shells under the seat locked and strapped the shotgun across my back could they bust me? i really needed to do that last summer but was worried i'd get hassled.

[walther_gsp]

I took a butt load of tactical classes about 10 years ago,Still got the deploma's. With TTC out in Adams county. would any of those classes suffice or are they out of date, because they were too long ago ?

Anything more than 6 years old doesn't count.

[walther_gsp]

Are there any instructors on here, and if so are you going to have a class anytime soon?

I'm an instructor, but I usually only teach during summer/fall.

[walther_gsp]

Are you teaching a class on March 14th?


nope

[ReconRat]

If i wanted to go shoot some skeet and take my bike..put the shells under the seat locked and strapped the shotgun across my back could they bust me? i really needed to do that last summer but was worried i'd get hassled.

Do this only if it's fun to see people drive off the road while gawking...

I've had the distinct pleasure of going to work on a motorcycle, wearing OD fatigue uniform with an M-16 strapped to my back. Steel pot buckled to the gauge cluster. My only worry was "what if" the M-16 fell off and I had to pay for it...

[max power]

If i wanted to go shoot some skeet and take my bike..put the shells under the seat locked and strapped the shotgun across my back could they bust me? i really needed to do that last summer but was worried i'd get hassled.


HAHA, that I gotta see......and get a picture. :motorcycle:

[v65rider]

I'm an instructor, but I usually only teach during summer/fall.

Do you know someone that may do one of the classes sooner?

[walther_gsp]

Do you know someone that may do one of the classes sooner?

I don't personally know anyone in your area thats teaching any time soon. However, here is a list of classes from the NRA website.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 07, 2009, 6400 Stonebridge St., $100
Charles Smith, 614-948-2053. , buckeyeguns@yahoo.com
Class types: Basic Pistol


# Columbus - Sunday, February 08, 2009, 1, $150
J.D. Blackfoot, 614-545-8045. , jdblackfoot@msn.com
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Meets all certification requirements for Ohio Concealed Carry License and all staff memebers are certified NRA instructors. For more info please call 614-545-8045 or email jdblackfoot@msn.com Thank You

# Columbus - Saturday, February 14, 2009, 1505 Bethel Rd., $125
Ray Davidson, 614-742-7197. , rdavidson@tenable.net
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
This class will satisfy the State requirements for a CHL license.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 14, 2009, 6400 Stonebridge St., $100
Charles Smith, 614-948-2053. , buckeyeguns@yahoo.com
Class types: Basic Pistol


# Columbus - Saturday, February 14, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL/CCW. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Monday, February 16, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL/CCW. (Class is conducted over 2 evenings). Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Wednesday, February 18, 2009, 4444 Indianola Ave, $150
Ron Herman, 614-263-1601. , pstryjew@att.net
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Exceeds Requirements for Ohio CCW. Over 16 years of teaching NRA courses. Male and Female instructors. Firearms and ammo included. Includes NRA membership.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 21, 2009, 1505 Bethel Rd., $125
Ray Davidson, 614-742-7197. , rdavidson@tenable.net
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
This class will satisfy the State requirements for a CHL license.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 21, 2009, western Licking Cty/central OH, $150
Clint Lake, 614-561-8810. , CLake@insight.rr.com
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
ONE DAY CLASS! All firearms, ammo, lunch & dinner provided. Meets & exceeds Ohio concealed carry requirements. Learn from those who are in the Statehouse working to improve YOUR gun rights!

# Columbus - Saturday, February 28, 2009, 1505 Bethel Rd., $125
Ray Davidson, 614-742-7197. , rdavidson@tenable.net
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
This class will satisfy the State requirements for a CHL license.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 28, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL/CCW. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Saturday, February 28, 2009, 6400 Stonebridge St., $100
Charles Smith, 614-948-2053. , buckeyeguns@yahoo.com
Class types: Basic Pistol


# Columbus - Monday, March 02, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Sunday, March 08, 2009, western Licking Cty/central OH, $150
Clint Lake, 614-561-8810. , CLake@insight.rr.com
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
ONE DAY CLASS! All firearms, ammo, lunch & dinner provided. Meets & exceeds Ohio concealed carry requirements. Learn from those who are in the Statehouse working to improve YOUR gun rights!

# Columbus - Saturday, March 14, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Saturday, March 14, 2009, 1505 Bethel Rd., $125
Ray Davidson, 614-742-7197. , rdavidson@tenable.net
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
This class will satisfy the State requirements for a CHL license.

# Columbus - Monday, March 23, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Saturday, March 28, 2009, 2738 Sawbury Blvd, $125
Al E Smith, 614-395-1305. , Al@AlSmith.US
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
Course meets training requirement for Ohio CHL. Class size limited to 12 people.

# Columbus - Saturday, April 18, 2009, western Licking Cty/central OH, $150
Clint Lake, 614-561-8810. , CLake@insight.rr.com
Class types: Basic Pistol

Course Notes:
ONE DAY CLASS! All firearms, ammo, lunch & dinner provided. Meets & exceeds Ohio concealed carry requirements. Learn from those who are in the Statehouse working to improve YOUR gun rights!

[Isaac's Papa]

http://a587.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/25/l_829ca2b050cf731c3febb1697f01032a.jpg


If I'm not mistaken the muzzle is supposed to be down. IDK for sure, though.

[cattmouch33]

http://a587.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/25/l_829ca2b050cf731c3febb1697f01032a.jpg


If I'm not mistaken the muzzle is supposed to be down. IDK for sure, though.

That looks like a good time right there.

[flounder]

For that pic ^^ couple of things.. The magazine has to be out of the weapon and the action should be locked open with a flag in it showing its not loaded.

[Isaac's Papa]

For that pic ^^ couple of things.. The magazine has to be out of the weapon and the action should be locked open with a flag in it showing its not loaded.


Wouldn't that depend on what state he's in??

[flounder]

Wouldn't that depend on what state he's in??


Not if he doesnt want to get a ticket for inciting a panic. They way he is in that pic, he could get "Inciting a panic" ticket in every state.

[Isaac's Papa]

Not if he doesnt want to get a ticket for inciting a panic. They way he is in that pic, he could get "Inciting a panic" ticket in every state.


They could ticket him for it but the court would toss it out. You cannot be charged with inciting panic if you aren't breaking the law. Besides, removing the magazine and locking the bolt won't make a difference to the public. They'll piss themselves, either way.

[kawi kid]

Besides, removing the magazine and locking the bolt won't make a difference to the public. They'll piss themselves, either way.


Fact!

[Gump]

Really? stick a fag in the action and it's good to go?

[max power]

You dont have any fags in Carrollton, just dykes. You're not going to stick any dykes in the action.

[cmoosego]

You dont have any fags in Carrollton, just dykes. You're not going to stick any dykes in the action.
what about the dutch boy that stuck his finger in the dyke??? that got some action.....

[Gump]

LMAO...lots of Dutch, dyke, finger, fag, flag action.

I like flag football

[smashweights]

As far as the no weapons allowed signs, my curiosity is this: say your local taco bell has one and you have it legitimately concealed, who's ever gonna know to get you caught?

[Isaac's Papa]

As far as the no weapons allowed signs, my curiosity is this: say your local taco bell has one and you have it legitimately concealed, who's ever gonna know to get you caught?

Well, nobody if you don't have to use it, but not respecting someone's right to keep guns out of their establishment is kind of shitty.. in my arrogant opinion.

[smashweights]

Well, nobody if you don't have to use it, but not respecting someone's right to keep guns out of their establishment is kind of shitty.. in my arrogant opinion.

while i agree with you, for the devil's advocate in me: is it more shitty for him to deny me my interpretation of my constitutional rights? and if he gets robbed and i bust a cap in the fucker, you think he'd still press charges?:eek:

[Isaac's Papa]

while i agree with you, for the devil's advocate in me: is it more shitty for him to deny me my interpretation of my constitutional rights? and if he gets robbed and i bust a cap in the fucker, you think he'd still press charges?:eek:

He's not denying you your rights. You have the choice to not go to that particular Taco Bell. You deny your own right when you knowingly walk through the door unarmed. Some disagree with my stance on private property rights trumping 2nd Amendment rights, but it's not your house. Play by the owner's rules or find another sandbox to play in.

I see what you're saying about defending his property and you'd probably not face charges unless the owner is a devout pacifist, hence the CPZ, and you kill someone in front of him. Then, you're probably fucked.

[smashweights]

lol ok. think that'd be a dick move to save someone's ass and then have them press charges like that.

[MidgetTodd]

wouldnt be the first time for a move like that

[fusion]

I guess you don't care if anyone comes into your home and doesn't follow the rules of your property. Private property is private property.

A wise man once said, "It's my house, and if you don't like it, you get the fuck out!" :D

[Isaac's Papa]

A wise man once said, "It's my house, and if you don't like it, you get the fuck out!" :D

Wow! You knew my dad? Weird.

[max power]

having a ccw licence's is a big problem if u ask me...u get treated like a convicted when u get pulled over, you always have to read up on new laws all the time...shit is dumb i got arrested and takin to jail when a cop seen me in my garage working on my bike and seen my gun wuz on my side the cop apporcted the garage and asked me if i seen some guy's on a 4 wheeler i said no i didnt he grabs my hand and puts it behind my back and goes do u have any weapons on u i stated yes i have my gun and i have a ccw licences he said what are u suppost to say when u see a officer and u have ur ccw licences...and i said inform then u are carring a gun but i never know if im in my garage minding my biz and u walk up on me asking me a question about some guys on a atv....i spent 2 days in jail....for this act so everyone beware...lol i got it droped in court but i cant get the 2 days of my life back....lol

I gotta call bullshit here, or ask, how much did you get from the wrongful imprisonment lawsuit?

[Likwid]

Thank goodness my motorcycle mechanic doesn't post a no guns sign :)

I agree that it's their property, once they open it to the public I don't feel they have a right to prohibit CONCEALED carry... but as Pauly said, that's my opinion.

[Isaac's Papa]

Thank goodness my motorcycle mechanic doesn't post a no guns sign :)

I agree that it's their property, once they open it to the public I don't feel they have a right to prohibit CONCEALED carry... but as Pauly said, that's my opinion.

They have the right because you aren't limited to that establishment. Plus, you aren't forced to pay them. Making a government building a no carry zone is infringement. Not giving my establishment money because I don't allow carry is free market. I love free market.

I don't discriminate. I let people with Hi Points inside as well as citizens with real guns. :p

[Likwid]

They have the right because you aren't limited to that establishment. Plus, you aren't forced to pay them. Making a government building a no carry zone is infringement. Not giving my establishment money because I don't allow carry is free market. I love free market.

I don't discriminate. I let people with Hi Points inside as well as citizens with real guns. :p

While you're not forced to pay them, you're forced (if you do) to be put at risk. We're still talking the same thing as before, laws don't stop criminals, and neither do stupid little signs or the owner of an establishment being a whiny baby.

I never brought a HiPoint in your house!

[JRMMiii]

Do the guys with HiPoints ride Q-links?

You'd think that the quality of their weapon would be reflected in the quality of the other things they have in life.

Or, maybe they're rocking wrecked GXSR750s with decent-sized apartments?

[Isaac's Papa]

While you're not forced to pay them, you're forced (if you do) to be put at risk. We're still talking the same thing as before, laws don't stop criminals, and neither do stupid little signs or the owner of an establishment being a whiny baby.

I never brought a HiPoint in your house!

The bolded section is what makes your defense flawed. You don't HAVE to patronize my establishment. However, if I am legally obligated to purchase tags for my car, appear for court summons or even taxed to pay for postage stamps and I'm not allowed to carry in those places. That is the difference. I'm taxed to pay for a court house that I'm not allowed to carry inside of. You don't have to give me any of your money.


Do the guys with HiPoints ride Q-links?

You'd think that the quality of their weapon would be reflected in the quality of the other things they have in life.

I've owned a Hi Point. It was my very first firearm. Of course, I've also owned a Kawasaki, so I see your point.

[Likwid]

The bolded section is what makes your defense flawed. You don't HAVE to patronize my establishment. However, if I am legally obligated to purchase tags for my car, appear for court summons or even taxed to pay for postage stamps and I'm not allowed to carry in those places. That is the difference. I'm taxed to pay for a court house that I'm not allowed to carry inside of. You don't have to give me any of your money.


So you're a fan of "separate but equal"?

[Isaac's Papa]

So you're a fan of "separate but equal"?

I don't know that term. :confused:

[Strictly Street]

/thread resurrected.
I thought Gun + non-believers fit well with Guns + Churches

Proposed Law Would Allow Guns in Churches
http://www.katv.com/news/stories/0109/590527.html

Copied text for the ones who have the site blocked or can't get the link:

Discuss.

I also wonder how everyone would feel if this story was done about a mosque or synagogue. Let the Jews and Muslims CC in their respective places of worship... acceptable or not?


Weapons in a Mosque? :lol:
It's not PC to pick on Muslims or Jews, of course they can have their guns.

[Likwid]

We're allowed guns, just can't buy Lugers

[chevysoldier]

while i agree with you, for the devil's advocate in me: is it more shitty for him to deny me my interpretation of my constitutional rights? and if he gets robbed and i bust a cap in the fucker, you think he'd still press charges?:eek:

You CANNOT use deadly force to protect property. Now if the robber had a gun pointed to his head, then you would be able to use deadly force. But If I were in an establishment while CC'ing where they posted a CPZ sign, then I don't know if I would shoot to protect him. One side of me says it would be the right thing to do, the other says he gave up the opprotunity to be protected, or actually took the opprotunity to be unprotected, so why would I want to risk taking punishment for him? Free (mostly) right?

[Isaac's Papa]

You CANNOT use deadly force to protect property. Now if the robber had a gun pointed to his head, then you would be able to use deadly force. But If I were in an establishment while CC'ing where they posted a CPZ sign, then I don't know if I would shoot to protect him. One side of me says it would be the right thing to do, the other says he gave up the opprotunity to be protected, or actually took the opprotunity to be unprotected, so why would I want to risk taking punishment for him? Free (mostly) right?

I disagree. If someone enters an establishment with enough gumption to rob it at gunpoint I have no reason to believe they don't have the balls to shoot someone. Eliminate the threat before an innocent person gets shot/killed.

[chevysoldier]

and if he gets robbed and i bust a cap in the fucker, you think he'd still press charges?:eek:

You CANNOT use deadly force to protect property. Now if the robber had a gun pointed to his head, then you would be able to use deadly force. But If I were in an establishment while CC'ing where they posted a CPZ sign, then I don't know if I would shoot to protect him. One side of me says it would be the right thing to do, the other says he gave up the opprotunity to be protected, or actually took the opprotunity to be unprotected, so why would I want to risk taking punishment for him? Free (mostly) right?

I disagree. If someone enters an establishment with enough gumption to rob it at gunpoint I have no reason to believe they don't have the balls to shoot someone. Eliminate the threat before an innocent person gets shot/killed.

First of all, he never said he robbed it at gun point. This is from the Ohio CCW Handbook.

"
In Ohio, deadly force can be used only to prevent serious bodily harm
or death. Deadly force can never be used to protect property only. Depending on the specific facts and circumstances of the situation, use of
deadly force may lead to criminal charges and/or civil liability."

My whole point was he needs to be sure the store owner was in danger of his life, then yes it's ok to use deadly force. But as his scenario stated he was only being robbed, not being a threat to life, especially not at gun point. That being said, how many people try to rob a place without a weapon? Not too many but it does happen and you need to be fully aware of the situation AND the threat at hand.

[fusion]

I disagree. If someone enters an establishment with enough gumption to rob it at gunpoint I have no reason to believe they don't have the balls to shoot someone. Eliminate the threat before an innocent person gets shot/killed.

Unless they've changed it since I read about it, I believe Ohio Castle Doctrine supports this..

[chevysoldier]

Castle Doctrine
Under certain changes enacted in 2008, a person does not have a duty
to retreat from the residence that they lawfully occupy before using force
in self-defense or defense of another. Additionally, there is no duty to
retreat if the person is lawfully in that person’s vehicle or lawfully is an
occupant in a vehicle owned by an immediate family member of that
person. However, being a lawful occupant of a residence or vehicle is
not a license to use deadly force against an attacker. The person who is
attacked, without fault of his own, may use deadly force only if he reasonably
and honestly believed that deadly force was necessary to prevent
serious bodily harm or death. If the person does not have this belief, he
should not use deadly force. Again, if it does not put your life or the life
of others in danger, you should withdraw from the confrontation if it is
safe for you to do so.

[Likwid]

Castle doctrine only appliees to motor vehicles and residence... and the only thing it does is remove your duty to retreat, the other 2 fingers of self defense still apply.

[Isaac's Papa]

First of all, he never said he robbed it at gun point. This is from the Ohio CCW Handbook.

"
In Ohio, deadly force can be used only to prevent serious bodily harm
or death. Deadly force can never be used to protect property only. Depending on the specific facts and circumstances of the situation, use of
deadly force may lead to criminal charges and/or civil liability."

My whole point was he needs to be sure the store owner was in danger of his life, then yes it's ok to use deadly force. But as his scenario stated he was only being robbed, not being a threat to life, especially not at gun point. That being said, how many people try to rob a place without a weapon? Not too many but it does happen and you need to be fully aware of the situation AND the threat at hand.


No, but if someone is trying to rob me without a gun I'll still draw on them. At that point they have a few choices. They can lie down on the ground like I tell them to, they can turn and run out the door, or they can charge me and get shot to death. Just because someone isn't armed with a gun doesn't mean they can walk out the door with someone's money/property. They will only be shot if they choose to be shot. The choice is solely on their shoulders.

[chevysoldier]

No, but if someone is trying to rob me without a gun I'll still draw on them. At that point they have a few choices. They can lie down on the ground like I tell them to, they can turn and run out the door, or they can charge me and get shot to death. Just because someone isn't armed with a gun doesn't mean they can walk out the door with someone's money/property. They will only be shot if they choose to be shot. The choice is solely on their shoulders.
But see now you say they charge you and get shot. There is your deadly force. You didn't shoot them to protect property, you shot them to protect your life which is fine. Pulling a weapon is not deadly force. Shooting them is.

[Likwid]

Meaning, you still must perceive immediate serious bodily harm and you must not be the agressor...

If someone comes into a store and robs it, you still have a duty to retreat, regardless of perceived threat to your person.

When in your home or on your bike you don't HAVE to attempt retreat, but that doesn't mean you should ignore. If retreat is a viable alternative, you should still use it, but you can't be charged if you don't.

[Likwid]

well, to IP, would you be willing to stand up in court and defend yourself by saying he ran at you and you feared he would cause harm? probably.

But you MUST still attempt retreat, "hey, I don't want any part of this, I'm leaving"... if you don't do that in some form... you haven't satisfied requirements under self defense.

[Isaac's Papa]

Meaning, you still must perceive immediate serious bodily harm and you must not be the agressor...

If someone comes into a store and robs it, you still have a duty to retreat, regardless of perceived threat to your person.

When in your home or on your bike you don't HAVE to attempt retreat, but that doesn't mean you should ignore. If retreat is a viable alternative, you should still use it, but you can't be charged if you don't.

I have the duty to retreat if possible. Also, if I have the opinion that bodily harm will come to an unarmed employee of that store I have a moral obligation to make sure that doesn't happen.

If someone comes into my house unannounced they will most likely be shot to death. Circumstances will dictate action and outcome, but I have no plans of retreating from my own home...ever.

[Isaac's Papa]

But you MUST still attempt retreat, "hey, I don't want any part of this, I'm leaving"... if you don't do that in some form... you haven't satisfied requirements under self defense.

Not if I perceive eminent danger to those I'd be leaving behind. The robber has a choice once I draw my weapon. He can retreat, he can lie down, or he can attempt to rid me of my weapon and be shot.

[JRMMiii]

I thought you just had to yell 'They're coming right at us' before you shoot?
http://www.tvgasm.com/shows/duh29.jpg